MnGCA Home MnGCA
Minnesota Geocaching Association
 
 FAQFAQ   SearchSearch   User listUser list   UsergroupsUsergroups   RegisterRegister 
 ProfileProfile   Log in to check your private messagesLog in to check your private messages   Log inLog in 

What constitutes a find?
Goto page 1, 2  Next
 
Post new topic   Reply to topic    MnGCA Forum Index -> Northern MN
View previous topic :: View next topic  
Author Message
navychief98
Geocacher


Joined: 11 Sep 2011

Posts: 78

PostPosted: Sun Aug 05, 2012 7:00 pm    Post subject: What constitutes a find? Reply with quote

I live in Duluth. Over the past several weeks, I've noticed a great number of catchers claiming the "smilie" of a find yet, in their remarks, they state they DID NOT SIGN THE LOG!

What's up with that? I can sit at home and write logs like that.

As a cache owner, I delete logs if the Cacher states they did not sign the log.

What are your thoughts on this?
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Pear Head
Past MnGCA President


Joined: 04 Apr 2004

Posts: 5690
Location: north of Duluth

PostPosted: Sun Aug 05, 2012 7:34 pm    Post subject: Re: What constitutes a find? Reply with quote

navychief98 wrote:
I live in Duluth. Over the past several weeks, I've noticed a great number of catchers claiming the "smilie" of a find yet, in their remarks, they state they DID NOT SIGN THE LOG!

What's up with that? I can sit at home and write logs like that.

As a cache owner, I delete logs if the Cacher states they did not sign the log.

What are your thoughts on this?


Hey - I live in Duluth too! Wink

I think you'll find two schools of thought here:

1. People play the game the way they want to - just let them play.

2. Your name needs to be in the log to gain credit for the smiley.

I subscribe to #2.

http://support.groundspeak.com/index.php?pg=kb.page&id=309

Code:
Physical caches can be logged online as "Found" once the physical log has been signed.


Further,

http://support.groundspeak.com/index.php?pg=kb.page&id=307#maint

Code:
Owner is responsible for geocache listing maintenance. As the owner of your cache listing, your responsibility includes quality control of all posts to the cache listing. Delete any logs that appear to be bogus, counterfeit, off-topic or otherwise inappropriate.


To me the game, like any game, has rules. You don't let people that play soccer just play the way they want to play, right? To me the rules outline your responsibilities as a cache finder (sign the logbook) and as a cache owner (maintain your listing).

Like I said though, you'll find that people subscribe to different schools of thought here - this is just my $0.02.
_________________
Hmm...
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website AIM Address Yahoo Messenger
Rustynails
Geocacher


Joined: 27 Oct 2009

Posts: 782

PostPosted: Sun Aug 05, 2012 7:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Some times it's not possible to sign a log.

1. The log is full and no room to sign.
2. The log is to wet.
3. The log is damaged or torn.
4. The log is missing.
5. The cache is missing.
6. Lost or broken writing tool.

I have had the same said happen on my caches, but I don't delete the find..

As a CO you have to be understanding and flexible. You do have the right to deny a smiley. Just as you did when I found one of your hides missing and confirmed it with you. I generally don't request a smiley, but much time and effort was put in the search. I was not going to make a long return drive for one cache. Play the game as you wish.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Pear Head
Past MnGCA President


Joined: 04 Apr 2004

Posts: 5690
Location: north of Duluth

PostPosted: Sun Aug 05, 2012 7:51 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Rustynails wrote:
Some times it's not possible to sign a log.

1. The log is full and no room to sign.
2. The log is to wet.
3. The log is damaged or torn.
4. The log is missing.
5. The cache is missing.

I have had the same said happen on my caches, but I don't delete the find..

As a CO you have to be understanding and flexible. You do have the right to deny a smiley. Just as you did when I found one of your hides missing and confirmed it with you. I generally don't request a smiley, but much time and effort was put in the search. I was not going to make a long return drive for one cache. Play the game as you wish.


These are all true and I can subscribe to the flexibility here except for #5. To me it's not a find if the cache is missing - it's a did not find.
_________________
Hmm...
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website AIM Address Yahoo Messenger
jicknarson
Geocacher


Joined: 26 Dec 2008

Posts: 36

PostPosted: Sun Aug 05, 2012 7:55 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Pear Head wrote:
Rustynails wrote:
Some times it's not possible to sign a log.

1. The log is full and no room to sign.
2. The log is to wet.
3. The log is damaged or torn.
4. The log is missing.
5. The cache is missing.

I have had the same said happen on my caches, but I don't delete the find..

As a CO you have to be understanding and flexible. You do have the right to deny a smiley. Just as you did when I found one of your hides missing and confirmed it with you. I generally don't request a smiley, but much time and effort was put in the search. I was not going to make a long return drive for one cache. Play the game as you wish.


These are all true and I can subscribe to the flexibility here except for #5. To me it's not a find if the cache is missing - it's a did not find.



My thoughts exactly... and situations 1 through 4 can be remedied by carrying a piece of paper in a ziploc.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
navychief98
Geocacher


Joined: 11 Sep 2011

Posts: 78

PostPosted: Sun Aug 05, 2012 8:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Pear Head wrote:
Rustynails wrote:
Some times it's not possible to sign a log.

1. The log is full and no room to sign.
2. The log is to wet.
3. The log is damaged or torn.
4. The log is missing.
5. The cache is missing.

I have had the same said happen on my caches, but I don't delete the find..

As a CO you have to be understanding and flexible. You do have the right to deny a smiley. Just as you did when I found one of your hides missing and confirmed it with you. I generally don't request a smiley, but much time and effort was put in the search. I was not going to make a long return drive for one cache. Play the game as you wish.


These are all true and I can subscribe to the flexibility here except for #5. To me it's not a find if the cache is missing - it's a did not find.



I would have say each of the 5 descriptions would ea DNF unless the Cacher fixed #1-4...I stand with Pear Head. #5 has to be a definite DNF...
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
bflentje
Geocacher


Joined: 29 May 2006

Posts: 4019

PostPosted: Mon Aug 06, 2012 7:27 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Rustynails wrote:
Some times it's not possible to sign a log.

1. The log is full and no room to sign.
2. The log is to wet.
3. The log is damaged or torn.
4. The log is missing.
5. The cache is missing.
6. Lost or broken writing tool.


Yep, which is why I play a variation of both lines of thinking with a lean towards the more pure method.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
bflentje
Geocacher


Joined: 29 May 2006

Posts: 4019

PostPosted: Mon Aug 06, 2012 7:29 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

navychief98 wrote:
Pear Head wrote:
Rustynails wrote:
Some times it's not possible to sign a log.

1. The log is full and no room to sign.
2. The log is to wet.
3. The log is damaged or torn.
4. The log is missing.
5. The cache is missing.

I have had the same said happen on my caches, but I don't delete the find..

As a CO you have to be understanding and flexible. You do have the right to deny a smiley. Just as you did when I found one of your hides missing and confirmed it with you. I generally don't request a smiley, but much time and effort was put in the search. I was not going to make a long return drive for one cache. Play the game as you wish.


These are all true and I can subscribe to the flexibility here except for #5. To me it's not a find if the cache is missing - it's a did not find.



I would have say each of the 5 descriptions would ea DNF unless the Cacher fixed #1-4...I stand with Pear Head. #5 has to be a definite DNF...


#5 would not be a valid excuse on my list. In fact, if it's a HIGH STAR cache, #6 would not be allowed either unless there was documented proof of the cache being in your hands.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Pear Head
Past MnGCA President


Joined: 04 Apr 2004

Posts: 5690
Location: north of Duluth

PostPosted: Mon Aug 06, 2012 8:49 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

bflentje wrote:
navychief98 wrote:
Pear Head wrote:
Rustynails wrote:
Some times it's not possible to sign a log.

1. The log is full and no room to sign.
2. The log is to wet.
3. The log is damaged or torn.
4. The log is missing.
5. The cache is missing.

I have had the same said happen on my caches, but I don't delete the find..

As a CO you have to be understanding and flexible. You do have the right to deny a smiley. Just as you did when I found one of your hides missing and confirmed it with you. I generally don't request a smiley, but much time and effort was put in the search. I was not going to make a long return drive for one cache. Play the game as you wish.


These are all true and I can subscribe to the flexibility here except for #5. To me it's not a find if the cache is missing - it's a did not find.



I would have say each of the 5 descriptions would ea DNF unless the Cacher fixed #1-4...I stand with Pear Head. #5 has to be a definite DNF...


#5 would not be a valid excuse on my list. In fact, if it's a HIGH STAR cache, #6 would not be allowed either unless there was documented proof of the cache being in your hands.


What was #6 again?
_________________
Hmm...
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website AIM Address Yahoo Messenger
WestSideDaddy
Past MnGCA Board


Joined: 06 Apr 2010

Posts: 559

PostPosted: Mon Aug 06, 2012 8:55 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

#6 was broken writing utensil.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
mnfishnutz
Geocacher


Joined: 07 May 2009

Posts: 86

PostPosted: Mon Aug 06, 2012 11:38 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I give them the find if their reason is 1 - 4. I don't give them #5 since they didn't find anything.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Pear Head
Past MnGCA President


Joined: 04 Apr 2004

Posts: 5690
Location: north of Duluth

PostPosted: Mon Aug 06, 2012 11:48 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

WestSideDaddy wrote:
#6 was broken writing utensil.


Ahh - he added that after I quoted the original post.

I don't think I'd accept that either. You should be responsible enough to bring a writing utensil - I know I've found my fair share of caches that I could not log as I didn't have a pen (and I've made my fair share of trips back to the car to get one)...
_________________
Hmm...
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website AIM Address Yahoo Messenger
bflentje
Geocacher


Joined: 29 May 2006

Posts: 4019

PostPosted: Mon Aug 06, 2012 12:53 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Pear Head wrote:
WestSideDaddy wrote:
#6 was broken writing utensil.


Ahh - he added that after I quoted the original post.

I don't think I'd accept that either. You should be responsible enough to bring a writing utensil - I know I've found my fair share of caches that I could not log as I didn't have a pen (and I've made my fair share of trips back to the car to get one)...


On a 1/1 or even a 2/2 cache, I really could care less if the log is marked, assuming the finder is honest about the find. But on anything higher than, say, 3/3, I have a much higher standard. If you just found a 4.5/4.5, wouldn't you want your name on the log?? I would.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Draconisdax
Geocacher


Joined: 02 Nov 2007

Posts: 982
Location: Southeastern Minnesota

PostPosted: Mon Aug 06, 2012 2:42 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Rustynails wrote:
Some times it's not possible to sign a log.

1. The log is full and no room to sign.
2. The log is to wet.
3. The log is damaged or torn.
4. The log is missing.
5. The cache is missing.
6. Lost or broken writing tool.

I have had the same said happen on my caches, but I don't delete the find..

As a CO you have to be understanding and flexible. You do have the right to deny a smiley. Just as you did when I found one of your hides missing and confirmed it with you. I generally don't request a smiley, but much time and effort was put in the search. I was not going to make a long return drive for one cache. Play the game as you wish.


Regarding most...is the reason I carry a Sharpie Marker...typically I have two...but...for the examples...
#1 - I have been known to sign over the names of others on a full log...it may not be kosher...but I have done it. (Unless I do have paper available...but I have seen more caches with a collection of partial logs then those with only one log...more of a mess then a solution)...I will say...those have been caches that have had NM posted multiple times for full logs...I guess in the owner doesn't care, neither should I...
#2 - Sharpies work well in this case...you get a huge name...but they work well...been very few logs for which I was unable to sign
#3 - Unless town to pieces...again, a Sharpie works very well
#4 - If I have paper, I add it...otherwise I snap a couple pics, email them to the owner and add that info to my log...being descriptive as possible (without giving anything away)
#5 - DNF...I personally do not place "throw-downs"...I will place a cache if asked by the owner...and yes...to be 100% forthcoming, I have logged a cache that was the result of a "throw-down"...along the lines of reviewers and "perceived/assumed" permission for placements...I assume the placer has permission of the owner...if not, a deleted log will not bother me and I will go out and find the cache (again) once the owner has replaced it...
#6 - Hasn't happened since carrying my own writing tool...
_________________
You may only be young once...but I will be immature forever!!!
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
dornole
Geocacher


Joined: 03 Apr 2006

Posts: 458

PostPosted: Mon Aug 06, 2012 4:11 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

A finder could just log "TFTC" and avoid the whole issue . . . .that's why I'm not inclined to delete somebody's find. They were just trying to be honest about the cache condition or their own forgetfulness.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Display posts from previous:   
Post new topic   Reply to topic    MnGCA Forum Index -> Northern MN All times are GMT - 6 Hours
Goto page 1, 2  Next
Page 1 of 2

 
Jump to:  
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum


Powered by phpBB © 2001, 2002 phpBB Group
Geocaching Cache Icons, Copyright 2009, Groundspeak Inc. All rights reserved. Used with Permission.