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MNGCA Geocoin?
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MNMizzou
Geocacher


Joined: 23 Feb 2005

Posts: 704
Location: Maple Grove, MN

PostPosted: Sun May 01, 2005 3:46 am    Post subject: MNGCA Geocoin? Reply with quote

While surfing the main GC forum I came across this state specific geocoin, which made me wonder if MnGCA could do a similar thing, with the State/tree logo on the one side? I think this group had to reach a minimum 250 orders before the casting or whatever it is called started... might be something cool and unique to offer.

http://www.mrcogeo.com/cogeocoins/
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jaywc7
Geocacher


Joined: 13 Sep 2004

Posts: 360

PostPosted: Sun May 01, 2005 4:59 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

If it's a possibility,,, count me in for a few!

I love the concept of coins. They are so much more permanent and fun to work with then TBs. The stamped sheet metal doesn't really impress me.
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Marsha and Silent Bob
Past MnGCA President


Joined: 02 Sep 2003

Posts: 6261

PostPosted: Sun May 01, 2005 5:10 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

jaywc7 wrote:
They are so much more permanent and fun to work with then TBs. The stamped sheet metal doesn't really impress me.

They aren't any more permanent than any other traveler. In my experience they are stolen even more frequently than the TBs.

Geocoins require a large investment in advance and a decent design... Two things that we probably won't be able to come up with... At least not now.
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towlebooth
Past MnGCA Board


Joined: 26 Nov 2002

Posts: 1270
Location: Saint Paul

PostPosted: Mon May 02, 2005 7:03 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Marsha and Silent Bob wrote:

Geocoins require a large investment in advance and a decent design... Two things that we probably won't be able to come up with... At least not now.


Heh. Design. What we need is a professional!
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Marsha and Silent Bob
Past MnGCA President


Joined: 02 Sep 2003

Posts: 6261

PostPosted: Mon May 02, 2005 7:06 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

towlebooth wrote:
Heh. Design. What we need is a professional!

Well, in this particular case, we do. As I said above, geocoins require a huge up-front investment. Most associations covers this cost with pre-orders. In order to get the coin loving cachers (CLCs) to put their money up we need something that looks half decent.

Especially when we need ~150 - 200 CLCs to do it Smile
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KC0GRN
Past MnGCA Board


Joined: 22 Feb 2004

Posts: 1424

PostPosted: Mon May 02, 2005 10:37 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I've had a little experience in purchasing other associations geocoins, and from my dealings with them on a national level, I've found many people tend to buy 5-10 coins just so they have some to trade out, and usually they don't terribly care about the design. Every association I've come across has not only managed to sell out what coins they had minted, but even ordered second batches to meet the demand on them. Plus most of the coin manufacturers are willing to work out a design if you supply them with a rough idea of what you'd like on the coin.

Guess there's still the initial investment, but I'd be willing to chip in some initial, and know of at least one other cacher that would.

Anyways, sorry to stir the pot on this issue, I'll shut up now.
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jaywc7
Geocacher


Joined: 13 Sep 2004

Posts: 360

PostPosted: Mon May 02, 2005 10:41 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
They aren't any more permanent than any other traveler. In my experience they are stolen even more frequently than the TBs.


Well - if you think of the actual material, which is what I was referring to, of the coin, versus the material used to make the Travel Bugs, I think it's much more sound. As far as the investment goes - I agree. There is upfront cost and design issues. I think however that if someone looked into some minting websites and did some calling around, they'd find that we could easily mint up a couple hundread coins. There are basic templates we could use, and then maybe throw in a tree or a loon, or something cool like that. I'm sure there is a process which can be followed with easy steps. As far as the money goes, do the math... I for one, would probably order 5 I think. So let's say that the average order is 2 or 3. that's only 60-70 people that have to be interested out of 300 or however many we've got. It would definately take some planning on someone's part, and a little work (which I would love to take part in if I wasn't stuck in AZ), but there's got to be someone out there who is willing to atleast check into it and see what they find. Isn't there??? If it just wont work right now, I understand. I'm going to keep persuading though because I think it would be really cool! Oh ok - here's another idea : I've seen that some people have little wooden pieces that have their name or team name or something stampped or burnt on to them. Maybe that's another possibility and would be cheaper and perhapps a better idea to start out with? Is there some way we could have serial numbers and all? Even if we had a few pieces of our own, and no formal way of logging them, we could use a selected forum to half-a** log them if we really wanted to... I think it would be so neat!
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Arcticabn
Past MnGCA Board


Joined: 30 Nov 2003

Posts: 1846
Location: Lakeville, MN

PostPosted: Mon May 02, 2005 11:23 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Having done this twice for military coins SB is right in that there is a significant up front cost. Usually anywhere from $500 to $2500 depending upon the type of coin, detail of the design and the material used to make the coin. Also whether the coin is stamped or poured.

The initial cost is in the design and set up. We can have a detailed design but it's still has to be developed into the stamp or pour mold.

Then there is the issue of the minimum order. In the military we always created two types of coins. Sterling Silvers for those who were original participants and then Bronze for all following personnel. This of course doesn't necessarily apply here as we don't view coins as a personal posession but more as a TB or trade item. So only one type of material would probably be necessary.

Lastly, if we plan to use the GC logo I believe that the board would need to enter into an agreement with GC.com for it use.

Either way you cut it there is an up front cost to the organization or to the original vendor. It's not unfeasible to be accomplished. It's just going to need a higher level of participation among the organization to accomplish or for the few to shell out higher $.
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jaywc7
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Joined: 13 Sep 2004

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PostPosted: Mon May 02, 2005 11:47 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
anywhere from $750 to $2500


Wow! I had no idea there was a cost like that associated with this.

I was definately out of line then!

Wooden Nickels anyone??? Laughing
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Arcticabn
Past MnGCA Board


Joined: 30 Nov 2003

Posts: 1846
Location: Lakeville, MN

PostPosted: Mon May 02, 2005 11:54 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

OK some quick research into one challenge coin manufacturing site.

Here is an example of pricing that I have found on the web.

Coin Size 1 5/8
Coin Thickness 3mm Die Struck
Coin Color: 1 color Antique Gold Coin - Bronze Color Coin & Black Shiny

Die Set Up Charge $200
25-49 Coins $4.53 each
50-99 Coins $3.40 each
100-300 Coins $2.40 each
301-700 Coins $2.30 each
701-1000 Coins $2.15 each

Prices do not include shipping, handling or taxes.

There fore a minimum order of 25 coins would require an investment of $313.25 (die $200 + $113.25 for 25 coins) plus shipping and taxes. Figure $350 with the shipping and taxes. This is approximately $14 per coin.

For 50 coins it would be $370 plus shipping and taxes. Figure $410 total. This is approximately $8.20 per coin ($200 die + $170 for 50 coins).

In order to get the per coin price down to below $5.00 then we would need to order 100 coins. The investment would then be about $440 plus shipping and handling. Figure $60 for shipping and handling then each coin would cost $5.00.

So in order to make this worth the outlay we would need to come up with approximately $500 up front money.


Then there are always those pesky additional charges:

Ribbed edge to coin: $100 one time die charge.
Serial Numbering on Coins: $0.35 per coin
Color Fill (one side enamel baked paint) $0.28 per coin
Sterliing Silver Coins: $35.00 each In addition to coin count above.


So whats the bottom line. Approximately a $600 investment to get 100 serial numbered coins.
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jaywc7
Geocacher


Joined: 13 Sep 2004

Posts: 360

PostPosted: Mon May 02, 2005 12:26 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ah - that's not too bad of pricing... We'd definately want the serial numbering, but who cares about the rest I'd say.

Thanks for doing some research!
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towlebooth
Past MnGCA Board


Joined: 26 Nov 2002

Posts: 1270
Location: Saint Paul

PostPosted: Mon May 02, 2005 12:30 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'll buy 5 if the board goes ahead with this. Would informal pre-orders help?

My personal feeling is that we would like coins first, design second. Throw the logo, URL and association name on it an get-er-done.
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Marsha and Silent Bob
Past MnGCA President


Joined: 02 Sep 2003

Posts: 6261

PostPosted: Mon May 02, 2005 12:31 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

jaywc7 wrote:
We'd definately want the serial numbering, but who cares about the rest I'd say.

Those of us with a vested interested in the association and how we look to those both in and outside of the state.

Personally? If we were distributing a coin I would be VERY DISAPPOINTED if we didn't take the time to make it unique, interesting, and worthwhile to purchase.

Yeah, most of the collectors probably don't care how it looks, how it was made, or anything else, but as a member of this association and a resident of this state, I care.
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s4xton
Past MnGCA Board


Joined: 23 Mar 2003

Posts: 1070
Location: Minneapolis, MN

PostPosted: Mon May 02, 2005 12:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

towlebooth wrote:
My personal feeling is that we would like coins first, design second. Throw the logo, URL and association name on it an get-er-done.


If we're going to do something, let's do it right.

There was recently a very good conversation about a potential MnGCA geocoin after the last general meeting. I think there was a good consensus that if we're going to do it, let's do it right, and let's do it in a way that people from all over will want a Minnesota coin... and let's think outside of the box! (anyone care to chime in with some of the ideas we tossed out? We were just on the beginning of the brainstorming. Buzzygirl were you recording this? Wink)

Let's do it in a way that we can be proud of, and not just doing it just to do it for the sake of having a stupid coin.

-Aaron
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towlebooth
Past MnGCA Board


Joined: 26 Nov 2002

Posts: 1270
Location: Saint Paul

PostPosted: Mon May 02, 2005 12:46 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

s4xton wrote:

There was recently a very good conversation about a potential MnGCA geocoin after the last general meeting about this. I think there was a good consensus that if we're going to do it, let's do it right, and let's do it in a way that people from all over will want a Minnesota coin... and let's think outside of the box (anyone care to chime in with some of the ideas we tossed out? Buzzygirl were you recording this? Wink)

Let's do it in a way that we can be proud of, and not just doing it just to do it for the sake of having a stupid coin.


That's fine. Great is always better then good.

I would ask that we set a timetable so that we can all see progress. All ideas submitted by ??, board chooses final 2-3 designs by ??, forum voting on final designs on ??, coins delivered on ??

Something like that to give structure to the discussion and give the impression that it will go ahead.
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