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Luce Line Regional/Luce Line State confusion by reviewers
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jschlecht
Geocacher


Joined: 25 Oct 2012

Posts: 7

PostPosted: Sat Aug 24, 2013 5:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I emailed the geocache permit contact at Three Rivers today. Will relay her message and hopefully get some clarity on the jurisdiction issues for the Luce Line.
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Gat R Done
Minnesota Reviewer


Joined: 29 Dec 2011

Posts: 39

PostPosted: Sun Aug 25, 2013 7:38 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

The preferred process would be to submit an application for approval to Three Rivers Park for a geocache placement. If it is approved, TPR will email a response to the Reviewers directly.

Is that what you did?
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bflentje
Geocacher


Joined: 29 May 2006

Posts: 4050

PostPosted: Tue Aug 27, 2013 7:52 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

And then you have the issue of the KML's being used by the reviewers don't match up exactly with reality.. like the boundary for an SNA being about 30-40' off the mark. I would never knock a reviewer because I know how much of a time commitment the job can be but I am wondering why reason couldn't be used to make an exception to something that is clearly an error?
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Draconisdax
Geocacher


Joined: 02 Nov 2007

Posts: 982

PostPosted: Wed Aug 28, 2013 7:59 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Gat R Done wrote:
spinowner wrote:
ArcherDragoon wrote:
Placement of geocaches is restricted to within 25 feet of a trail center line, and must not involve disturbance of the park environment.


That's taken a bit out of context. The 25 foot trail center line is referring to trails that are inside the parks where the permit process is in effect.

The policy can be found here: http://www.threeriversparks.org/activities/geocaching-rules.aspx

Here is the complete posting from ArcherDragon of the TRP policy with some important details in bold:



Quote:
Geocaching Guidelines

Three Rivers supports geocaching in most of the parks. Please follow the geocaching guidelines when placing or retrieving caches:

Geocaching is allowed in regional parks and park reserves within Three Rivers Park District.
Geocaches must be registered with Three Rivers Park District using the Geocache Site Registration Form.
Geocaching is not allowed at Noerenberg Gardens or The Landing Minnesota River Heritage Park, or on regional trails.
Placement of geocaches is not allowed at the following facilities within parks: golf courses, campgrounds, reservation picnic areas, creative play areas, or beaches.
Placement of geocaches is restricted to within 25 feet of a trail center line, and must not involve disturbance of the park environment.
There is no maximum limit to the number of geocaches placed within a specific park; however, geocaches must not be placed within .25 miles of another geocache.
Placement of geocaches within maintained landscape plantings is prohibited.
Geocaches are not to contain items that are offensive, dangerous, or illegal.
Access to geocaches will be subject to the Park District ordinance including hours of operation, designated trail uses, maintenance standards and natural resources management activities.
Three Rivers Park District retains the right to remove a cache if determined to be in an inappropriate location, or if it is not registered with the Park District.



At any rate, as Reviewers we use sophisticated tools that utilize the electronic maps provided by Three Rivers Park District (TRPD) to determine if a trail is a TRPD Regional Trail. We do not use pdf maps.

TRPD's maps for the Luce Line Trail, begin at Theodore With Parkway and extend westward across all of Hennepin County to the Carver County Line.

Any changes to that or permission to place new caches on any TRPD Regional Trail would need to come directly from our normal geocache permitting approval contact, not a public relations contact.


And...to be fair...I copy-pasted from their website...nothing more...nothing less...
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Draconisdax
Geocacher


Joined: 02 Nov 2007

Posts: 982

PostPosted: Wed Aug 28, 2013 8:00 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Gat R Done wrote:
The preferred process would be to submit an application for approval to Three Rivers Park for a geocache placement. If it is approved, TPR will email a response to the Reviewers directly.

Is that what you did?


And...Boom...there it is...Did you get the required permit before submitting your cache placement for publishing?
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timewellspent
Geocacher


Joined: 19 Mar 2008

Posts: 706

PostPosted: Wed Aug 28, 2013 9:29 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

ArcherDragoon wrote:
Gat R Done wrote:
The preferred process would be to submit an application for approval to Three Rivers Park for a geocache placement. If it is approved, TPR will email a response to the Reviewers directly.

Is that what you did?


And...Boom...there it is...Did you get the required permit before submitting your cache placement for publishing?


The point is, the person wanting to place the cache on this trail doesn't feel a permit is required based on Three Rivers site saying that part of the trail isn't controlled by them. If that is the case why should a permit be requested when they say it isn't under their control?
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Draconisdax
Geocacher


Joined: 02 Nov 2007

Posts: 982

PostPosted: Wed Aug 28, 2013 9:43 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Gat R Done wrote:
spinowner wrote:
ArcherDragoon wrote:
Placement of geocaches is restricted to within 25 feet of a trail center line, and must not involve disturbance of the park environment.


That's taken a bit out of context. The 25 foot trail center line is referring to trails that are inside the parks where the permit process is in effect.

The policy can be found here: http://www.threeriversparks.org/activities/geocaching-rules.aspx

Here is the complete posting from ArcherDragon of the TRP policy with some important details in bold:



Quote:
Geocaching Guidelines

Three Rivers supports geocaching in most of the parks. Please follow the geocaching guidelines when placing or retrieving caches:

Geocaching is allowed in regional parks and park reserves within Three Rivers Park District.
Geocaches must be registered with Three Rivers Park District using the Geocache Site Registration Form.
Geocaching is not allowed at Noerenberg Gardens or The Landing Minnesota River Heritage Park, or on regional trails.
Placement of geocaches is not allowed at the following facilities within parks: golf courses, campgrounds, reservation picnic areas, creative play areas, or beaches.
Placement of geocaches is restricted to within 25 feet of a trail center line, and must not involve disturbance of the park environment.
There is no maximum limit to the number of geocaches placed within a specific park; however, geocaches must not be placed within .25 miles of another geocache.
Placement of geocaches within maintained landscape plantings is prohibited.
Geocaches are not to contain items that are offensive, dangerous, or illegal.
Access to geocaches will be subject to the Park District ordinance including hours of operation, designated trail uses, maintenance standards and natural resources management activities.
Three Rivers Park District retains the right to remove a cache if determined to be in an inappropriate location, or if it is not registered with the Park District.



At any rate, as Reviewers we use sophisticated tools that utilize the electronic maps provided by Three Rivers Park District (TRPD) to determine if a trail is a TRPD Regional Trail. We do not use pdf maps.

TRPD's maps for the Luce Line Trail, begin at Theodore With Parkway and extend westward across all of Hennepin County to the Carver County Line.

Any changes to that or permission to place new caches on any TRPD Regional Trail would need to come directly from our normal geocache permitting approval contact, not a public relations contact.


^This...

Public Relations does not equal the Geocaching Department

(Yes...I know...there isn't a "Geocaching Department"...but Gat R Done did a great job - as did Fruitcake; of answering the question AND outlining the process/procedure about who/where/how to contact the person responsible)
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Boreal Walker
Geocacher


Joined: 14 Aug 2008

Posts: 231

PostPosted: Wed Aug 28, 2013 9:45 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Where is a dead horse when you need one?
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timewellspent
Geocacher


Joined: 19 Mar 2008

Posts: 706

PostPosted: Wed Aug 28, 2013 11:01 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

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Moe the Sleaze
Geocacher


Joined: 10 Jan 2003

Posts: 1146

PostPosted: Thu Aug 29, 2013 6:57 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Gee, I miss the days of being Surfer Joe. Rolling Eyes
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King Boreas
Geocacher


Joined: 16 Dec 2002

Posts: 2441

PostPosted: Thu Aug 29, 2013 7:22 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Moe the Sleaze wrote:
Gee, I miss the days of being Surfer Joe. Rolling Eyes


That was YOU Question
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jschlecht
Geocacher


Joined: 25 Oct 2012

Posts: 7

PostPosted: Wed Sep 04, 2013 7:51 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

After some emails to the geocaching permit contact at Three Rivers she had to go to her GIS specialists to check it out. The Luce Line WEST of Vicksburg is again open to place caches. The reviewers now have the corrected info so cache on. Thanks to the reviewers and Three Rivers for their patience on this matter.
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